Nvidia claims PC gaming is dead without them

[TronFAQ]

Nvidia has been saying and doing some really stupid things lately.

• They made sure Batman: Arkham Asylum would only have working anti-aliasing with their cards
• Disable PhysX if you have a second card in your computer that isn't one of theirs (be it ATI, or even the older Aegia PhysX cards which no longer work)
• Cripple CPU PhysX if you don't have an Nvidia card
• Said DirectX 10.1 was useless and irrelevant (while quietly starting to introduce DX 10.1 on their lower-end cards)
• Showed a fake GT300/Fermi card at their recent Nvidia conference
• Now also say DirectX 11 is irrelevant (until they have their new GT300 card ready, which is when DX 11 will suddenly become the greatest thing ever) . . .

Need I go on?

But this latest statement from them, takes the cake.

So Nvidia is singlehandedly keeping PC gaming alive, huh? Riiiiight. Hey, I'm not saying they aren't important and aren't doing good things. But if Nvidia went out of business tomorrow, I think we'd still see PC games being released and they wouldn't all be crappy ports.

And saying things like "If we hadn't done anything with Batman, for example, what we would have had is the continuing end of PC gaming" doesn't exactly put them on the moral high ground, does it? I mean, they're supposed to be in the business of keeping PC gaming alive. It's still a significant part of their income. But then they go and make a stupid comment like this.

If they're really looking out for PC gaming, and things are as "dire" as they claim they are, then maybe they're not actually doing their job? I dunno. I just think that the rep from Nvidia really shot himself in the foot, there. "We're singlehandedly keeping PC gaming alive, but it's gone to s.h.i.t anyway so screw it . . . don't be surprised if we pulled out tomorrow, that it died." That's essentially the message he's giving.

[win3k]

Afternoon chaps

What a bizarre set of conclusions to draw. My penny's worth is that PC gaming is kept alive by:

1. Continually pushing the boundaries of realism and immersion
2. The Mod community
3. An older, cash-rich, more mature gaming demographic
4. The Mod community

Contrary to the views of the doom-mongers, I feel pretty confident that PC gaming will be around for rather a lot of time to come.

win3k

[xistence]

The whole universe can't exists without me. 'nuff said.

[TronFAQ]

The whole universe can't exists without me. 'nuff said.

.

2. The Mod community
4. The Mod community

So important, he said it twice!

I fully agree, and it still amazes me how so many publishers refuse to release tools or an SDK to allow the players to make their own maps or mods. They're either afraid that free releases from the community will diminish the demand for their own paid ones, or it's because they're worried about another "hot coffee" type of scenario. (Yeah, I'm aware that the "hot coffee" content in GTA was already there rather than the community creating it. Which is why Take Two got hammered by the courts. But this event seems to have made a lot of publishers very nervous that they can be held liable for user created content, just the same.)

But I think that Valve and Bethesda, for example, have proven how important and worthwhile user created content is. Bethesda released an SDK for Fallout 3, and that hasn't stopped them from releasing and being able to sell 5 expansions. People will still pay for the expansions, if they're good enough.

[win3k]

Morning chaps

it still amazes me how so many publishers refuse to release tools or an SDK

Sadly, I suspect that the reason why this happens is simple: the beancounters can't see a way to monetize the effort required to release and support dev tools/SDKs.

Clearly, Valve (L4D, HL etc.) and Epic (UT) have shown that the payback is simply that the community stays around and vibrant for much longer than for other games (Bioshock, f'rinstance), with occasional cash opportunites for the original publisher (Gary's mod, Counter Strike), but my guess is that because these paybacks are uncertain, and hence can't be written into a business plan, for some publishers the costs (minimal as they are; the tools are already in existance) outway the benefits.

win3k

[SweatyPyro]

The whole universe can't exists without me. 'nuff said.

Oh My God.....you're right.

I need to go lie down now.

[TronFAQ]

Veering somewhat off-topic from the original post, I came across a couple of radically different views about player content creation and modding that I thought were interesting.

• Exhibit A: Gabe Newell of Valve, in a conference where he flew to Australia to meet a modder and evaluate his Left4Dead campaign. The whole thing started out as a joke, but Gabe decided to go anyway and take a look at the kid's work. What other game developer or publisher would do that? (Answer: Precisely zero.)
  
  Just watch the early part of the video, where Gabe speaks. He's as pro-community and pro-modding as they come, if we can take him at his word. (You can stop watching when Joe starts to talk, because he doesn't really have much to say . . .)
• Exhibit B: Yahtzee of Zero Puncuation fame. He's started writing a column called Extra Puncuation, and his latest diatribe basically puts down the entire player content creation movement.
  
  Now, normally I agree with him at least 90% of the time. And I get what he's trying to say here. But I still think he's being way too harsh. I mean, take a look at this quote.
  

  Q. Was this level designed by someone who is employed professionally as a games designer or in another relevant creative industry?
  
  If no, f.u.c.k it.

Ouch. Come on Yahtzee. Way to over-generalize, to create a sensational column meant to get people up in arms. You can't really mean that.

Everyone is an amateur before they become a professional. We all have to start somewhere. If you don't give amateurs a chance, we'll never get anywhere. And what about Yahtzee himself? Is he a "professional"? Until a year or two ago, you could easily argue he wasn't. What if the Escapist hadn't given him a second look, because he was something of an "amateur" at the time they discovered him?

He's being rather hypocritical here. Yes, as I mentioned before, I get what he's trying to say. The vast majority of players just aren't very good at making maps, mods, etc. They're not willing to commit themselves to their creations, no matter how long it takes. But this latest article of his comes across a bit too much like sensationalist drivel.

[cryogen4000]

Well! i think being able to make game mods/maps/models/in any capacity should be encouraged more by the modding community and definitely by the professional developers/tron 2.0 would have been lost to antiquity if
not for modders/and map makers/yeah! some of the amature made maps for tron 2.0 are very basic in design
but care factor zero! as they are still fun to play in and especially when tron 2.0 or other favourite game is no longer being supported any new map to run around in is great!! regardless of it complexity or design///and
the same can be said for modding***as for myself im no professional when it comes to map/model/making i like
to say im a noob+1 in my modding skills though im good with Unreal editor 3.0 a noob+8 but thats only due to the
support the tools have and the map/modding community has helped a lot also over the years in my understanding of unreal ed.......though! something i constantly encounter within the modding community is the large amount of discouragement and professional dogma i think the professionals that have their degrees dont like to be showed up by a hobbiest a backyard inventor i guess///and within any society there is prestige as i have found that its the same within the modding community you try hard for months to make your first map/mod and finally succeed to your self its a true master master piece then you release your master piece to the world with great excitement and you get nothing but backlash and criticism as to it construction and how amature it is and then you are ignored push to the fringes of the society in the hope you will not try again and be forgotten yes! im speaking from experience though i have always liked standing up to the establishment and im hard to put down but for most people one knockback and its all over and thats the real tragedy because its that person that could have found a cure for cancer as an example///LDSO forum tronfaq others really need to be commanded given an award or something for the outpouring of positive support they provide i was totally shocked by it extremely unexpected and i guess thats why i have chosen to post my ut2k4 gridmage mod here have a look!! now!! you can see the full Gabe interview on good game its our gaming show here in australia!
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/goodgame/

[TronFAQ]

Another somewhat on-topic issue.

http://kotaku.com/5384057/new-modern-wa ... -community

It's this kind of garbage (like what happened with Ghostbusters on the PC), that does not make me want to move to gaming on a console instead of a PC - like the video game industry is hoping - but rather, give up on gaming altogether.

I'm not even interested in Modern Warfare . . . but once they start pulling this crap with a "big" title like that and get away with it, it sets a precedent that everyone else will follow. (Except Valve, I guess.)

The day I'm locked into paying for every little bit of crap they release, constant online monitoring and control measures, and no possibility of creating maps or mods, is the day I stop playing games. Screw it.

[TRON.dll]

Another somewhat on-topic issue.

http://kotaku.com/5384057/new-modern-wa ... -community

It's this kind of garbage (like what happened with Ghostbusters on the PC), that does not make me want to move to gaming on a console instead of a PC - like the video game industry is hoping - but rather, give up on gaming altogether.

I'm not even interested in Modern Warfare . . . but once they start pulling this crap with a "big" title like that and get away with it, it sets a precedent that everyone else will follow. (Except Valve, I guess.)

The day I'm locked into paying for every little bit of crap they release, constant online monitoring and control measures, and no possibility of creating maps or mods, is the day I stop playing games. Screw it.

After watching Gabe's inspirational speech on user-created content, I'd really like to see what someone from Infinity Ward and/or Activision would have to say about it. I'd also like to see what Gabe has to say about Infinity Ward's (or Activision's) decision on Modern Warfare 2's exclusion of any potential user-created content.

[TronFAQ]

Excellent article about the Modern Warfare 2 dedicated servers debacle.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009 ... server.ars

My favorite quote from the article . . .

The lack of dedicated servers also means Activision Blizzard controls what mods, if any, will be allowed. You can't control what maps are running on the server, and fan-made maps offered for free may be a thing of the past, replaced by for-pay content, if this model catches on. This changes the relationship between the community and the publisher: you used to be able to buy a house and move in, but now you'll have to ask permission to paint the walls of your rental. Which, by the way, is more expensive. To show you just how far Infinity Ward has come since the last Call of Duty in terms of embracing the PC platform, take a look at an interview shot for the first Modern Warfare.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMfTR8PBrsE

In just a few short years, we've gone from embracing the mod-making and PC gaming community, to treating them like children who can't be trusted with nice things.

[SweatyPyro]

I'm not an expert, but:

Don't fix what ain't broke.

[TRON.dll]

Excellent article about the Modern Warfare 2 dedicated servers debacle.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009 ... server.ars

My favorite quote from the article . . .

The lack of dedicated servers also means Activision Blizzard controls what mods, if any, will be allowed. You can't control what maps are running on the server, and fan-made maps offered for free may be a thing of the past, replaced by for-pay content, if this model catches on. This changes the relationship between the community and the publisher: you used to be able to buy a house and move in, but now you'll have to ask permission to paint the walls of your rental. Which, by the way, is more expensive. To show you just how far Infinity Ward has come since the last Call of Duty in terms of embracing the PC platform, take a look at an interview shot for the first Modern Warfare.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMfTR8PBrsE

In just a few short years, we've gone from embracing the mod-making and PC gaming community, to treating them like children who can't be trusted with nice things.

And now PC gamers will be limited to an 18 player maximum on multiplayer servers (as opposed to the 32 player max on consoles). More dissapointments (from Ars Technica):

Q: Is there a console in the PC version of the game, so we can change our field of view from the xbox's default 65 FOV to 80 also can we tweaks the weapon damage for each gun, removes perks, graphical debris, breathing sway, also thru console like we where able to before or is this all gone?

Vince-IW: We would like you to play the game the way we designed and balanced it.

DudezTY: Since we cannot kick people in ranked matches, how will we stop hackers who get past VAC?

Mackey-IW: Our goal is to ban hackers from the game.

kaRMa: Please give me a direct answer. On the PC version. Are all games hosted by players, and is there a five-second delay when host migration is in effect?

Vince-IW: yes.

Moriarte: Ignoring IW.net, is the PC version a direct port of the console version?

Mackey-IW: No, PC has custom stuff like mouse control, text chat in game, and graphics settings.

Full article: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009 ... hought.ars

[TronFAQ]

Moriarte: Ignoring IW.net, is the PC version a direct port of the console version?

Mackey-IW: No, PC has custom stuff like mouse control, text chat in game, and graphics settings.

Full article: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009 ... hought.ars

As someone wrote in a comment, that guy wins the muppet award. Ooh look, the PC version has mouse support! What an innovation!

I used to want to work in the video game industry, but not any more. It's become an empty, hollow shell of its former self. It used to be about making good games, now it's just about money. I think we're rapidly approaching another video game industry crash.

[TRON.dll]

Moriarte: Ignoring IW.net, is the PC version a direct port of the console version?

Mackey-IW: No, PC has custom stuff like mouse control, text chat in game, and graphics settings.

Full article: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009 ... hought.ars

As someone wrote in a comment, that guy wins the muppet award. Ooh look, the PC version has mouse support! What an innovation!

I used to want to work in the video game industry, but not any more. It's become an empty, hollow shell of its former self. It used to be about making good games, now it's just about money. I think we're rapidly approaching another video game industry crash.

A friend of mine came up with a very good theory on why they're doing this: World of Warcraft.

Why? A fully featured Modern Warfare 2 would likely outsell World of Warcraft (also owned by Activision). World of Warcraft requires players to pay a fee every month. Modern Warfare 2 does not. More people buy games that are top sellers than ones that are not. They want more people to buy WoW than MW2.