The story behind the KA Mod

[TronFAQ]

Why can't you guys just behave? Another dichotomy, because there are people stealing credits, wooo, yay!

I'm getting tired of hearing this. I've sent you three private messages in the past, asking you to keep this matter private and to communicate to me how you feel credit has been "stolen" and what it is that you did for the KA mod. I was willing to address any concerns you had.

You ignored me. Instead, you insist on making a public spectacle out of this. (And you ask us to behave?) Well, so be it. Maybe it's for the best that this gets out in the open now, and the air is cleared once and for all.


Okay folks, you want to know why the KA mod disappeared? Here are the two main reasons why.

1) 9VoltChicken was unhappy about me compressing his skin textures for the multiplayer characters. I had forgotten that I made this promise to him. Whether or not there's any visible difference between compressed or uncompressed, I broke a promise. So I apologized to him for it, and I believe we've managed to settle our differences amicably in private. The next version of the mod will have uncompressed textures.

2) Jademz and some others are stating that they contributed to the mod, and weren't credited for it. But to this day, I have yet to receive a clear explanation from Jademz as to exactly what he contributed to the mod. He was never given any version of the mod to test, so I'd like him to explain to me once and for all, what he contributed.


And I want to hear it from you Jademz. Not from anyone else. In your own words, I want you to explain to me exactly what you did. At the same time, I'd like to hear who else feels they made a contribution, other than 9Volt.

The closest I've gotten to an explanation from you is that you "tested several attributes integral to benefits in the mod". Well that statement is so vague, as to be completely meaningless. Give me specifics.

[Jademz]

You want it simple? I made the posts about credits because you selfishly decided to change the mod on a whim, not telling the team that you were attempting to hijack every bit of source you could to make the mod yours somehow.

I thought you know better than to ask what I did to help the mod. You hung out on teamspeak and listened to our ideas for quite some time, then I find out that you guys are making the mod close door, meanwhile lies are being spead to keep me out of the private forums. (all the while stating to us that you would give us credit if you decided to make this) So just coincidentally, several people had thought up all of your mod before you, and you decided to turn it into your thing, no matter how you try to spin it, I know we all had 3 months of planning involved in designing what the contents would be, meanwhile several others are including myself, are left in the dark, while you spead lies about Avanze accusing me of saying Aura was a transvestite, which you also knew better than to spread lies about me, as I am not that type of person, but it says alot about your friends, since I was kicked out of the forums because you can do it.

So there's the simple outline of what happened. I'm sure everyone is so interested to find that out, what it's actually on a thread.. how long will this last? It's so controversial.

Now, on the topic of what I did for credits in The Killer App Mod, It would be lame for me to say that I thought of much of what you did, even if I did, because I didn't apply it, and you know all to well what to to with other people's interests obviously. Go ahead and play dumb, or whatever one calls that lack of attention.

9voltchiken sat on teamspeak asking for ideas or helping you, but because I didn't want to make a scene, I said nothing about it. Anybody could make this mod. It's almost irrelevant, except you figured out a way to piss me off, lol I still can't believe people so arrogant are part of this community, but alas. 9volt just asked to include people that were relevant, which you did for your addition of the mod.

Several people including myself did help him with designing certain things that 9voltchiken thought important to add, I tested and helped with some variants of skins on several models, which was the most recent thing I worked on, as well as helping retain 9volts team status, which you coincidentally have no desire to reinstate, and the credits he brought with his share in the mod are the important matter here, I don't have the time or patience to be so be worried about mine. What, is it your mod? Like others who helped you, I, nor, they probably ask for credit, but now that's because your Tronfaq. Well, I've never been so insulted by one person, FYI. and I'll leave it at that.

Making your mod manager/skin packer was such a great thing you did for the mod? All that time you take for figuring everyone's credits, and that's the best thing you made? Thus I turn your thread back to you.

(EDITED: I, nor they)

[TronFAQ]

not telling the team

What team? At that point, no team had been formed. We were just kicking around "wouldn't it be cool, if . . ." ideas for a mod. Nobody was seriously committed to making a mod at that point.

You hung out on teamspeak and listened to our ideas for quite some time, then I find out that you guys are making the mod close door

There was some back and forth of ideas for a potential mod, yes. And I know that I contributed my fair share of ideas, and was asking for feedback about it.

Did you come up with the idea to include new multiplayer characters? Did you come up with the idea of changing the Light Cycle trails? To add back the flashing wheel spokes? To restore the Disc Primitive spin animation? To fix the trails and blocking colors for the discs? To add the Rod Primitive and Energy Claw to Derez? To fix mistakes in the Single Player portion of the game? To allow a proper 3rd person view in Single Player?

Explain to me which specific ideas that you feel that you came up with, alone. That were "stolen". Everyone that I was aware of as having come up with significant ideas or made significant contributions, was credited.

Are you trying to say that merely coming up with the idea of a mod in Multiplayer, is somehow stealing a proprietary idea? Without specific instances where you feel ideas of yours were "ripped off", I don't see where you're coming from.

I know we all had 3 months of planning involved in designing what the contents would be, meanwhile several others are including myself, are left in the dark

Pardon me? Three months of planning? This planning must have been something I wasn't a part of. There was no formal planning for this mod that I was aware of, on Teamspeak. It was all very informal.

I'm sure everyone is so interested to find that out, what it's actually on a thread.. how long will this last? It's so controversial.

The whole point of this thread is to find out what your beefs are, and to address them. If it doesn't last or gets locked, that will be because you or anyone else can't converse with me reasonably about this situation. Keep it civil, and it will stay open.

9voltchiken sat on teamspeak asking for ideas or helping you

9Volt didn't communicate to me that anyone had helped him, until after the mod was released. That was my fault, because I didn't wait for him to look over the mod before release. He could have communicated to me, what he felt was wrong or missing. But the mod release had already been announced, and I wasn't able to get in contact with him before the release.

Anybody could make this mod.

If anybody could make a mod like this, we would have seen one sooner. Come on, now. Be serious. No one person could make it alone, and not everyone has the patience or skills needed to make it. It involved several individuals who dedicated a lot of time and effort, and took 1 1/2 years to complete.

Several people including myself did help him with designing certain things that 9voltchiken thought important to add, I tested and helped with some variants of skins on several models, which was the most recent thing I worked on

Finally, you actually state what it is that you specifically feel you contributed to the mod. You helped test his skins. That's the only concrete thing you've mentioned, where you could possibly be owed credit.

Like others who helped you, I, northey probably ask for credit, but now that's because your Tronfaq. Well, I've never been so insulted by one person, FYI. and I'll leave it at that.

Hello! Is it called the TronFAQ mod? No, it's not. Everyone who I was aware of or considered to have made major contributions, was credited. I'm sorry that you feel that you were left out. As I've said before, I did offer to clear this up with you privately. You failed to respond.

[Jademz]

not telling the team

What team? At that point, no team had been formed. We were just kicking around "wouldn't it be cool, if . . ." ideas for a mod. Nobody was seriously committed to making a mod at that point.

You used that sentence incorrectly. The proper parallel was that the mod team you decidedly created, was dissed by you, and still are. - taking their hard work and mutilating the content they submitted w/out consulting them about their take on your actions, and I'm well aware of the work submitted for the mod you created.

The team-speak collaboration was was not uninformed, or lacking, it was a group of friends which had recorded efforts in making the mod, that was used in the killer app mod presently. You distanced yourself from our collaboration, and that's that. I helped 9volt get into the clan, then I got locked out. You have your fan club, who stand with you, but I could care less, (back then)I didn't need you guys either, I stuck up for all of you back when people would trash your good name on boxhat, also in the game, the voice of reason when the CPU clan would curse all of you publicly, I made them stop, and they did while I was around, but somehow, you get the same attention now directed to you for something completely unrelated, What irony.

There was some back and forth of ideas for a potential mod, yes. And I know that I contributed my fair share of ideas, and was asking for feedback about it.

Bullscript, you were quiet most of the time about making a mod with our material. I heard you ask, btw, but we all unanimously agreed on how we decided this material.

Did you come up with the idea to include new multiplayer characters? Did you come up with the idea of changing the Light Cycle trails? To add back the flashing wheel spokes? To restore the Disc Primitive spin animation? To fix the trails and blocking colors for the discs? To add the Rod Primitive and Energy Claw to Derez? To fix mistakes in the Single Player portion of the game? To allow a proper 3rd person view in Single Player?

Everyone in Tron 2.0 wanted what you are addressing. most of what you listed was discussed and recorded on teamspeak. I'm not giving you detailed information, since it's improbable that you care, nor does anyone esle. I didn't say I created mods for Tron 2.0. I did speak on fixing these things aesthetically, FYI, how selfish are you to think nobody complained? You wrote about the thousand-odd word buglist for Tron 2.0. We all wanted those FX, and we spoke as friends back then about making this mod, probably even the name.

I don't want to hear about your rablings about creator rights-

Explain to me which specific ideas that you feel that you came up with, alone. That were "stolen". Everyone that I was aware of as having come up with significant ideas or made significant contributions, was credited.

Are you trying to say that merely coming up with the idea of a mod in Multiplayer, is somehow stealing a proprietary idea? Without specific instances where you feel ideas of yours were "ripped off", I don't see where you're coming from.

Finally, you actually state what it is that you specifically feel you contributed to the mod. You helped test his skins. That's the only concrete thing you've mentioned, where you could possibly be owed credit.

9voltchiken sat on teamspeak asking for ideas or helping you

9Volt didn't communicate to me that anyone had helped him, until after the mod was released. That was my fault, because I didn't wait for him to look over the mod before release. He could have communicated to me, what he felt was wrong or missing. But the mod release had already been announced, and I wasn't able to get in contact with him before the release.

So that's why you fabricated your credits list. He contacted you multiple times, don't lie, we don't need a display.

Anybody could make this mod.

If anybody could make a mod like this, we would have seen one sooner. Come on, now. Be serious. No one person could make it alone, and not everyone has the patience or skills needed to make it. It involved several individuals who dedicated a lot of time and effort, and took 1 1/2 years to complete.

Yea.. please, tell me something I don't know. it would have been best if you didn't complicate the first release, and create bias within the clan and the making of the mod, nor with whom could contribute, that old nag..

Hello! Is it called the TronFAQ mod? No, it's not. Everyone who I was aware of or considered to have made major contributions, was credited. I'm sorry that you feel that you were left out. As I've said before, I did offer to clear this up with you privately. You failed to respond.

I responded to what you asked, you didn't read thoroughly appearently, and under the circumstance it wasn't my intention to collaborate in something run by a nazi.
You insist on having created the mod, so it's pointless to worry about it now. You've hijacked it for long enough. That's the point I'm making.
Not one time did you ask the KA team how the sharing and dissemination of thier content would impact them, and their work. Should one ask for anything less?

This has been in discussion since mid-2005 for those wondering. It's rediculous that I have to point you to the beginning of our wanting a mod for those who don't know. Everyone just want's it to be released because we enjoy the game, and most of us are a tight knit fanbase, this is a mockery for anyone to go to these extremes.

(EDITED: (back then)I didn't need you guys either)
p.s. this forum is adding quotes messing up my post, which I have to re-fix, so it appears I'm editing more than once.

[TronFAQ]

Bullscript, you were quiet most of the time about making a mod with our material.

If you're talking about the early days, no I wasn't.

Everyone in Tron 2.0 wanted what you are addressing. most of what you listed was discussed and recorded on teamspeak.

If you recorded it, then send me the recording. I'd like to hear it.

But I wasn't asking what everyone thinks. I was asking what you think. What specific, unique ideas do you feel you came up with but weren't credited for.

I'm not giving you detailed information, since it's improbable that you care, nor does anyone esle.

Good grief. I wouldn't be asking right now if I didn't care.

9Volt didn't communicate to me that anyone had helped him, until after the mod was released. That was my fault, because I didn't wait for him to look over the mod before release. He could have communicated to me, what he felt was wrong or missing. But the mod release had already been announced, and I wasn't able to get in contact with him before the release.

So that's why you fabricated your credits list. He contacted you multiple times, don't lie, we don't need a display.

I didn't fabricate anything. Everything on that list is something I worked on. If there's a question about who came up with an idea in the first place, that can be changed for the next version.

In the two weeks leading up to the release, when I wanted to ask him to look over the mod and test it: no, I was not contacted by 9Volt. Nor was I able to get in contact with him. He wasn't on ICQ or MSN, I couldn't find him in Teamspeak, and all the e-mails I sent didn't receive a reply. Later on, I found out that he was having computer trouble at the time. And that he'd also changed his e-mail address. Nobody told me that. Also, any e-mails he sent me weren't received, because the e-mail address they were sent to was incorrect.

I responded to what you asked, you didn't read thoroughly appearently

No, you didn't. I sent you three private messages, and you never responded. You're only responding to me now.

and under the circumstance it wasn't my intention to collaborate in something run by a nazi.

And here you prove to me that you can't discuss this without resorting to name-calling.

You insist on having created the mod

I'm sorry, but now it's my turn to ask . . . have you not read a thing I've said?

This has been in discussion since mid-2005 for those wondering. It's rediculous that I have to point you to the beginning of our wanting a mod for those who don't know.

Perhaps a mod was in discussion, but specific plans to make one didn't happen until late 2006.


I've read through your posts, and you still haven't given me a straightforward answer to a simple question. What did you do for the mod? Give me specifics. Why can't you explain what you did? You've given me one thing, you tested 9Volt's skins. Now what about the rest?

All I want to find out from you, is what you did so you can be credited for these things. Instead of giving me a straight answer, you've written some long rants that don't answer the question I'm asking.

I know what 9Volt has told me, but I wanted to hear it directly from you. I shouldn't be asking him to find out what you did: but since you won't answer me properly, I guess I'll have to take his word for it.

If you can't answer the question, then this thread has served its purpose. Peace. Out.

[Jademz]

Bullscript, you were quiet most of the time about making a mod with our material.

If you're talking about the early days, no I wasn't.

Perhaps I only saw you come into teamspeak about 15-20 times, and most of the chat was about how it couldn't be made. Then, 9voltchiken made a list, which I had, but have since lost, and is whom I refer as having written our ideas down.

During the "early days" I was unaware of the mod's form as I was kicked off of the site, (which I get no response..)which was only a few weeks apart. Later 9volt made me aware of the mod creation, and I was making a lightcycle map, lost my computer due to a brown-out, but at the time I heard of the mod I was never asked to contribute, by anyone, nor was I kept apprised of anything that took place, since you and/or the team clearly pulled it from what direction it had taken, IMO. Public material, how many would have loved that? maybe 10 people. and a creation with some healthy competition. but that's asking too much.

But I wasn't asking what everyone thinks. I was asking what you think. What specific, unique ideas do you feel you came up with but weren't credited for.

That's hard to remember, I'll tell you what I am aware that I discussed. adding characters from singleplayer, making new weapons, damage, FX, and designing the full integration of all three gametypes. Making changes in the game to add juke boxes, musical machine rooms, a ticker tape to leave messages in a gui in maps, or info, in my experience I used an image of how I would engineer maps as machines, so there was quite a broad amount of ideas I was carefully detailing to everyone on Teamspeak.

I recall you having our ideas since you came into the discussion somewhat open mindedly, and friendly. but as for me, I know many people say things they want similarly, and I'm not one to stand in the way of progress, but that's just a matter of opinion, since I'm responding to the antagonistic restraint showed on your part to release and handling of the KA mod. (not making little of what you did, if that's in question, but what the outcome is). But what I said is not the point, as you insist. I consider this good faith between fans, I am embarrassed to see this behavior that went on behind the scenes, I saw 9volt's work on skins, and having made atleast 10,500 textures and how you reguard him, and make a mockery of this process and his taking time, while your cold shoulder attitudes made it impossible to work with you, but alas, shame.

I didn't fabricate anything. Everything on that list is something I worked on. If there's a question about who came up with an idea in the first place, that can be changed for the next version.

Ok, that's a matter of opinion. I did notice the lines in the readme you released with the mod, with work that others did, but I'm not pointing them out. I don't speak for others on the mod team, which you quite willingly pursuit 9volt by simply reasoning of his association to me, and or what you believe influences or harms your ideas on the KA Mod. I'm only aware of his fight for making the mod right, and recalling him going through your 3 ring circus act to make it happen, in association. I know the team had no need or want for my influence for your personal gain, Since I'm not part of your clique. But I can say this, because I'm not afraid of, nor what is said.

In the two weeks leading up to the release, when I wanted to ask him to look over the mod and test it: no, I was not contacted by 9Volt. Nor was I able to get in contact with him. He wasn't on ICQ or MSN, I couldn't find him in Teamspeak, and all the e-mails I sent didn't receive a reply. Later on, I found out that he was having computer trouble at the time. And that he'd also changed his e-mail address. Nobody told me that. Also, any e-mails he sent me weren't received, because the e-mail address they were sent to was incorrect.

I don't find that possible, I'm on teamspeak nearly every day, and guess what, you haven't been there, I'm not accusing you, but I find this very unlikely, his email is shared by the whole team, and whatnot. He's on every messenger I have, not once have I forgotten his email, nor lost contact. You did contact several beta testers, and from what I saw, none of them designed or worked closely in the mods collaborative effort except for a few, but not all of the mod team/contributors?? how many people? five? or maybe I shouldn't ask.

No, you didn't. I sent you three private messages, and you never responded. You're only responding to me now.

9voltchicken made you aware of his list contributors/testers to my knowledge. I stated that I worked on the mod, and I believe you were well aware of this from 9voltchiken. Also, Anderson, Jumpy, WhiteRabbit, SuperSnoco, Tetsue(Raidarray) tested his additions to the KA mod.

and under the circumstance it wasn't my intention to collaborate in something run by a nazi.

And here you prove to me that you can't discuss this without resorting to name-calling.

That's a matter of opinion.

This has been in discussion since mid-2005 for those wondering. It's rediculous that I have to point you to the beginning of our wanting a mod for those who don't know.

Perhaps a mod was in discussion, but specific plans to make one didn't happen until late 2006.

Yes, best leave it at that, since I'm sure that there are several people who disagree with your happening to find out about their material, or how they discover your verification of credentials.(cough wide screen cough)

I know what 9Volt has told me, but I wanted to hear it directly from you. I shouldn't be asking him to find out what you did: but since you won't answer me properly, I guess I'll have to take his word for it.

I apologize that you consider my involvement in such a moment, the point I make is only one of good faith. My intention is to bring good content for the community, as you have, perhaps if you guys used good practices this wouldn't have come to be a red herring in the public. I have seen a long list of people helping with projects in this community, and how selfish those individuals are with credits, but I hope that that doesn't deter them from making an effort.

I write in the public forums simply because I was told not to. I don't trust anybody. Therefore, I use reason to find the truth, not back door upper eschelon tactics learned from a book. Then, I make my assessment. The mod team has made great efforts, and I look forward to seeing this mod, I hope they have a positive attitude about this mod's release as I would expect no less. maybe now this will be cleared up for the greater cause..


:shock:

(EDIT: a ticker tape to leave messages in a gui in maps) I don't want to hear it isn't relevant, I think I can understand what is included in the mod, so it is one idea that I use to reference, should there ever be a day I could make time for modding.)

[TronFAQ]

Finally, the kinds of answers I was looking for. PDT_Armataz_01_34

The rest of us will continue to work with 9Volt, to address his concerns and everyone else's for whom 9Volt acted as liason on the project.

Like I said, 9Volt already explained to me what you and the others did. But I wanted to give you a chance to explain your side of the situation, and be heard. I think this thread really has accomplished its purpose now. Thank you.

[Mor.Evil-1]

Sorry to interject here,
And Im surely to be dammed for making a post in this thread,

However was just curious on a few statements,
Made by you in your last post Jadmez.

perhaps if you guys used good practices this wouldn't have come to be a red herring in the public.

Which "Guys" are you referring to exactly?

I have seen a long list of people helping with projects in this community, and how selfish those individuals are with credits, but I hope that that doesn't deter them from making an effort.

With whom has wrongly not been credited and with which projects?

***Since this thread is mainly about deserved credit,
Might as well give any other individuals out there a chance,
To finally state: "I was not credited for my efforts, you owe me!"

So please if anyone else feels wrongly not credited,
For efforts and contributions to,
Any and or all projects ever created in the 2.0 community,
Post now, or forever hold your peace.

I write in the public forums simply because I was told not to.

Sorry, might be my old age, but from whom were you exactly told not to post in the public forums?

I don't trust anybody. Therefore, I use reason to find the truth, not back door upper eschelon tactics learned from a book.

Sorry to hear about your trust issues.
If you wouldn't mind,
Could you please share the book title,
To which you are referring,
"Back door upper eschelon tactics" can be learned from?
(Is it eschelon or echelon)

That's about it for now,

Thanks,
Mor

[Jademz]

Finally, the kinds of answers I was looking for. PDT_Armataz_01_34

Thanks for answering the questions I have about the mod creation/creators.

perhaps if you guys used good practices this wouldn't have come to be a red herring in the public.

Which "Guys" are you referring to exactly?

The people who use my friends(Aura) against me, Aura, was never called names or insulted by me, and I found that you received an email, (Avanze, Tronfaq, you, in that order) you were coerced into believing that I shared a picture and called aura a lipstick and leather wearing transvestite. or something to that effect. MMK? Does that sound familiar? Somehow it got into the private sector, but hmmm, I didn't do it. That person has been told to you, and I have witnesses. What a shame. So who did post that thread in the private forums Mor?


That was why I was asked to leave LDSO? because I hang out with people who throw us all under the bus? I would never have talked about, nor reguard Aura as a transvestite, even though I know Aura better than all of you, you make a mockery of my interests, and frienships, but why? Aura was a dear friend of mine, and I may snicker at the thought of him hiding it, I think Aura was a very nice person. I would never make someone feel bad about something they are shy about, and respected their privacy.


Or perhaps because I was drumming up support to build a mod? there's a good reason, you don't want a mutiny after all.

You answer that, please.

I have seen a long list of people helping with projects in this community, and how selfish those individuals are with credits, but I hope that that doesn't deter them from making an effort.

With whom has wrongly not been credited and with which projects?

***Since this thread is mainly about deserved credit,
Might as well give any other individuals out there a chance,
To finally state: "I was not credited for my efforts, you owe me!"

That is a private matter, and was directed to Tronfaq, but I'll address those motives, which was my intent. Several mappers have used their friends to help, then not give them credits, or in some cases refuse to. I am bothered about this, but it makes bad habits worse, and should never be practiced by those who ask/receive extra help, who value this nice community.

I know you give good creds in your readme Mor, that's great.

I write in the public forums simply because I was told not to.

Sorry, might be my old age, but from whom were you exactly told not to post in the public forums?

I'd rather not answer.

I don't trust anybody. Therefore, I use reason to find the truth, not back door upper eschelon tactics learned from a book.

Sorry to hear about your trust issues.
If you wouldn't mind,
Could you please share the book title,
To which you are referring,
"Back door upper eschelon tactics" can be learned from?
(Is it eschelon or echelon)

Mmm, I'll be sure you're the first person I tell if I find the name.

As for credits, I would appreciate not having this thread deleted, as do several other readers.

[Mor.Evil-1]

For starters,
Can we PLEASE get off the constant do not delete these posts requests.
There not going to be.

However being a privately own and funded forum,
If and when we feel a topic may or may not be appropriate,
We do reserve the right to delete it w/ or w/o any warning.

**Just to clear the air***
The reason your posts regarding the KAM,
Were relocated to a private closed Admin section of the forums,
Which is locked to only mine and Loads eyes,
Was:

1. To still have the posts in the data base.
2. (And I feel we have been rather clear on this), The issues revolving around the KAM were a private matter amongst the creators of that mod,
We chose to close any and all discussions/posts pertaining to the mod untill said problems could be resolved amongst those persons.

As FAQ has stated, the creators of the KAM are in the process of working out any and all issues, Thats about all I know pertaining to that.

When and if all problems are resolved,
We will then gladly put back any and all posts regarding the KAM and will once again make the KAM available for d/l.

3. I foresaw nothing but problems and the thread turning into a flame war,
So to avoid it turning into anything to negative, it was relocated and closed.

It wasnt a direct attack against you or anyone else. At the time the posts were made, (And I think everyone can agree with this) there was just to much hot air floating around and things deserved a chance to cool down.

So now onto some of your questions:

The people who use my friends(Aura) against me, Aura, was never called names or insulted by me, and I found that you received an email, (Avanze, Tronfaq, you, in that order) you were coerced into believing that I shared a picture and called aura a lipstick and leather wearing transvestite. or something to that effect. MMK? Does that sound familiar? Somehow it got into the private sector, but hmmm, I didn't do it. That person has been told to you, and I have witnesses. What a shame. So who did post that thread in the private forums Mor?

Petaining to this,
I dont know what email you are talking about. I have never received anything like this, I have looked in my archive, if I did it was deleated long ago.

Personally I cant ever recall having any issues with Aura.
I most certainly do not have any recolection,
(Be it you want to believe this or not) of being coerced into believing that you shared a picture and called aura a lipstick and leather wearing transvestite.

This is news to me.
So sorry no it does not sound familiar.

I dont even know what post your talking about,
That was allegedly made in the private team section.

I remember claims of this supposed post,
But dude its not there it does not exist.
It never did.

Everyone seems to think there is some big secret conspiracy going on in the team only section of our forums.

Its just a area Load and I provide for the members of LDSO.
Thats it. It a place they can come together and talk privately with their fellow co-members. I dont feel any more explanation needs to be made other than that.

Asking what is posted in that area as a non member,
Is like me asking to have access to your private email account.
I hope that makes some sense.

That was why I was asked to leave LDSO? because I hang out with people who throw us all under the bus? I would never have talked about, nor reguard Aura as a transvestite, even though I know Aura better than all of you, you make a mockery of my interests, and frienships, but why? Aura was a dear friend of mine, and I may snicker at the thought of him hiding it, I think Aura was a very nice person. I would never make someone feel bad about something they are shy about, and respected their privacy.

You were not asked to leave LDSO because of this alleged email and alleged remarkes made by you pretaining to Aura.

If that truely was the case here, and the grounds behind why you were asked to leave,(Which it wasnt),
Doesnt it sound as if we were backing up Aura due to something you allegedly and negatively said about Aura and we were then trying to assist and help Aura out? Thats how your statement sounds to me.

So how would we have been the wrong here?

Again the reasons behind why you were asked to leave will still remain private, and out of respect for you, I will not discuss them in a open public forum. As I have emailed you before, if you have any questions or concerns regarding your team status, you may email myself, Load or X at any time.

I have always liked you man,
If I didnt, I never would have asked you to join LDSO after CPU basically left you for vapor ware on the grid.

That is a private matter, and was directed to Tronfaq, but I'll address those motives, which was my intent. Several mappers have used their friends to help, then not give them credits, or in some cases refuse to. I am bothered about this, but it makes bad habits worse, and should never be practiced by those who ask/receive extra help, who value this nice community.

Being that you have both been openly discussing these matters,
Is the reason I asked about unjustly credits. If they are a private matter nuff said.

If anyone out there ever feels that they are due credits revolving around a 2.0 project, again I say post now or forever hold your peace!

I know you give good creds in your readme Mor, that's great.

Thanks, You saying that means a lot.

I'd rather not answer.

Ok thats fine,
I dont recall ever telling you,
Not to post in the public area of our forums,
Nor does Load.
We own this site,
So unless we told you,
Whoever else said it, it doesnt matter.
We would prefer that you would like to post in the forms,
Because you like to, not because you were told not to.

Also since you choose not to answer,
Than unfortunately I am unable to do anything about this,
Which is why I asked.

Mmm, I'll be sure you're the first person I tell if I find the name.

Much appreciated! :lol:

As for credits, I would appreciate not having this thread deleted, as do several other readers.

Dont worry, its staying.

[Jademz]

Petaining to this,
I dont know what email you are talking about. I have never received anything like this, I have looked in my archive, if I did it was deleated long ago.

Personally I cant ever recall having any issues with Aura.
I most certainly do not have any recolection

This is news to me.
So sorry no it does not sound familiar.

I dont even know what post your talking about,
That was allegedly made in the private team section.

I remember claims of this supposed post,
But dude its not there it does not exist.
It never did.

Good policy, saying nothing - may as well be a lie, since I know how you may have decided what you did. ..perhaps I knew more about these problems than you, and maybe, you can't deal with people, or thier problems, since you don't need or care for personal conflicts.. My skills, motives, and companions were against the grain, for you and your club. Fine keep it private, but keep in mind, I won't listen to propaganda.

Doesnt it sound as if we were backing up Aura due to something you allegedly and negatively said about Aura and we were then trying to assist and help Aura out? Thats how your statement sounds to me.

So how would we have been the wrong here?

Yes you were, but then you never saw that info. right? This propaganda aimed at me now, is about continued leak of information that was implied to be my fault, on teamspeak or forums or the grid.

That's a bad practice, but I realize now that is what you feared. It's just a freaking game. I could care less if you told me not to tell stuff that was already public info. I would never take your material, or harm your name, nor the clan intentionally, but unless you debate me on facts, oh but you don't play fair, so why make a scene.

So how would we have been the wrong here?Again the reasons behind why you were asked to leave will still remain private, and out of respect for you, I will not discuss them in a open public forum.

Bullscript. This would have ended if you had provided any respect, and stated your case. You insisted I leak. What? Tron 2.0 coolness? (not yours) wow, glad to be of such interest to you, friend. thanks. (which btw jump/runspeed was public) And you know what the rest is. You provide nothing that consists of truth one way or another in private. Dude, if someone has to say something, why explain yourself atleast one time.

I have always liked you man,
If I didnt, I never would have asked you to join LDSO after CPU basically left you for vapor ware on the grid.

Glad to hear it, I haven't noticed any progress, but likewise. I tend to know people in person best.

Being that you have both been openly discussing these matters,
Is the reason I asked about unjustly credits. If they are a private matter nuff said.

I am not asking for credits for myself. I have however extensively consulted many on the team, and perhaps intellectually bestowed my part of the formation, as I persist in making Tron 2.0 one of my top priorities.

I appreciate you taking your time with the topics, because the fan base was most important, cya later.

[Load81]

Good policy, saying nothing - may as well be a lie, since I know how you may have decided what you did. ..perhaps I knew more about these problems than you, and maybe, you can't deal with people, or thier problems, since you don't need or care for personal conflicts..

Sorry to hear that the explanations given to you were not to your satisfaction. I do believe that e-mails regarding why you were disbanded from the team have been sent out and responded to. The decision was ultimately a vote, not a one person decision.

[Jademz]

Sorry to hear that the explanations given to you were not to your satisfaction. I do believe that e-mails regarding why you were disbanded from the team have been sent out and responded to. The decision was ultimately a vote, not a one person decision.

Yeah, that's all nice.. Thanks for looking out.

[Load81]

You're welcome, any time! PDT_Armataz_01_37

[Mor.Evil-1]

I just dont follow you Jademz.

What do you want from me?

You continually pull things out of context.

I am trying to tell you the truth, but you insist I am a cronic lyer.

I am also trying to legitimatly explain what I know to you,
But you seem to already have your mind made up on all matters.

Again, Out of respect for you, for you ok,
I have repeatedly stated,
If you have any concerns or questions about your team status,
Contact myself,
Load,
Or X in private so we can work them out.

I dont see the need to make a public specticle of everything.


If you must discuss these matters in the public forums,
Now is you chance.

Make your list,
Post the problems for all to see,
And I will openly reply right here in the public forum.

What ever questions or statements you post,
I will answer them openly and honestly.

At that point it will be up to you,
Wether you choose to believe my answers or not.

Ball is in your court man.

Lets get this over with so we all can move on.

Mor